Month: July 2020

061 – Muslim Diversity, History, and Academics with Khalil Andani

Khalil Andani is an academic in the field of Islamic Studies. He holds prior degrees in Mathematics and Accounting and has a Master of Theological Studies degree from Harvard Divinity School. Currently he is an advanced PhD Candidate in Islamic studies at Harvard and specializes in Quranic Studies, the intellectual history of Islamic Philosophy, and Ismailism. I have invited him here to have a discussion about the academic study of Islam, the history of the Quran, and the internal diversity of Islam through history.

Youtube version

060 – Khalil’s journey from Islam

Khalil is the son of two Islamic converts. He is an African-American that left Islam about a decade ago. He’s had quite the journey, spent some years in Saudi as a teenager and even spent time studying Arabic in Medinah. He’s been quiet about his story thus far and this is the first time he’s coming on camera to speak about his journey and reflect on the movement. His story is really interesting and he shares some apt reflections on Islam.

Youtube version

059 – Interview with Former Muslim Convert Yahya (John)

I interview former Muslim convert Yahya on his journey into and out of Islam. Yahya works in the music industry and has a really interesting story of how he converted to Islam and eventually left it. He speaks about how Islam appealed to him as a Christian and how he ended up in the Pakistani Sufi community. He speaks really fairly, giving reasons why Islam appealed to him as a Christian and how he ended up in the Pakistani Sufi community as well as his disillusionment and the problems he saw within. Was definitely one of the most interesting conversations to date!

Youtube Version

058 – West African Exmuslim Younas’s Journey from Islam | How his friend Ibraheem also left Islam

A story of two young Muslims who found their way from faith to reason. Younas grew up in West Africa in a small town where everyone only memorized Quran. When he came to America he had to not just learn the language but catch up on everything else. Eventually he overcame this and found his way into a successful program at university studying what he loved. When he told his best friend Ibraheem they had deep discussions and he also left Islam! You don’t want to miss this one

Youtube Version

057 – THE TWO ABDULLAHS Live Call In Show | Yasir Qadhi Mohammed Hijab Fiasco | Quran Preservation

Join us for a live call in show. Everyone welcome to come and ask questions on air. We discuss the Yasir Qadhi Mohammed Hijab Fiasco and Quran Preservation

056 – Hassan The Somali Exmuslim Who Was Brutally Attacked In Kenya

Hassan, who is a Somalian living in Kenya, is also receiving credible and imminent death threats and has survived an attempt on his life and is subsequently on the run. Here is his story.

Hassan, who is a Somalian living in Kenya, is also receiving credible and imminent death threats and has survived an attempt on his life and is subsequently on the run. Here is his story.

News article about Hassan: https://globalvoices.org/2019/12/02/they-call-for-my-slaughter-somali-atheists-living-in-fear/

Hassan’s safety has been seriously compromised by local Islamic preachers who have campaigned against him as an apostate and his social media accounts have been hacked by people attempting to hunt him down for his atheism. Hassan has had to quietly and carefully stay on the move due to the attempts on his life. He has refugee status from the UN Human Rights Council, however, due to his financial situation he is still trapped in Kenya. He has been reaching out to other atheist associations and NGOs to support him via letters and campaigns since he knows he can no longer safely afford to live in this dangerous situation.

News article about Somali Atheists: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-52620433

055 – The danger of Islamism Interview with Hamed Abdel-Samad

I am going to be interviewing an Egyptian-German political scientist, author, and ex-Muslim extraordinaire @Hamed.TV.

The YouTube version of this interview can be found here: https://youtu.be/DxznDtS_sJw

054 – SLAVERY IN ISLAM TWO ABDULLAHS Call in Show

Fantastic livestream with Abdullah Gondal 😎🤘 we covered evidence of Muhammad engaging in buying and selling slaves, his wives getting mad, jealousy and infighting and we took calls from Mufassil Islam and another Muslim

Download the slides here

Donate to the show here

052 – Muslim For Two Months | Why Islam Appeals To White Westerners

I’m interviewing Jan from the Czech Republic who went from atheism to Islam and left it after several months. He is still a believer in God and we are going to go over his story and how the Dawah convinced him, and ultimately what caused him to leave it.

YouTube version can be found here: https://youtu.be/no9oJE7_d6c

049 – Interview with Wisam Hasan, Co-Founder of Atheism Without Borders

Wisam Hasan is a British Ex Muslim who lived in Iraq until 2006 at the peak of sectarian wars and terrorism (just before ISIS). He is going to talk about his experiences living in Iraq during those times especially as a closet exmuslim.

The YouTube version of this podcast can be found here: https://youtu.be/UneIXET2S4Y

048 – Interview with the Eric Wells, Former Christian, Support Director for Recovering From Religion

Eric Wells was raised in Southern California Baptist churches and private schools, and finally left his faith in 2012. In 2000 he started the non-profit organization, Volunteers Unite. When in operation, Volunteers Unite built homes for the needy in Mexico and matched hundreds of volunteers to causes they were passionate about. After his family moved to Missouri, he became a humanist and atheist. In Missouri, he volunteered with a local secular group, the Springfield Skeptics, and for whom he served as the Activism Director and the Executive Director. He has organized hundreds of community service events and volunteer activities, as well as the 2017 March For Science rally in Springfield, MO. He was the State Director for the American Atheists and fought to keep church and state separate at the city, county, and state levels.

047 – Interview with The Friendly Atheist Hemant Mehta

I will be interviewing the American activist Hemant Mehta. I have been a big fan of Hemant and his approach towards disseminating his views and have been following him for many years on social media since I left Islam. I always wanted to speak to him about his perspectives and his activism. Join us for a conversation between your friendly neighborhood ex-Muslim and The Friendly Atheist Hemant Mehta!

YouTube version of this podcast can be found here: https://youtu.be/M4mT-aWIRLo

Here are the timestamps:

0:00 Introductions
0:58 Why the friendly atheist?
3:25 Jainism – being an extreme follower of Jainism. Does Hemant take some parts of Jainism? The extreme fasting in Jainism.
8:20 Hemant’s perspective on Islamic fasting. Problems with Islamic fasting and how it does not seem to have been planned with a global audience in mind.
12:00 Is Christianity harmful to humanity?
14:30 Is Hemant an anti-theist? Hemant’s perspective on this label.
18:10 What is the biggest issue that needs to be tackled urgently? Why is it people tend to compartmentalize contradicting beliefs?
22:05 Are Muslims in the US more progressive than Christians when it comes to LGBTQ+ rights?
28:00 The difficulty in pulling apart cultural and Islamic teachings for example misogyny, chastity, and honor killing, and how younger Muslims are moving away from such practices.
31:25 Why is it important to allow free speech to criticize religion? Is it important to express the lack of belief?
34:20 Testimonials that Hemant receives from people questioning or leaving religion.
35:10 How long did it take Abdullah to change his beliefs from being a Muslim to being an atheist? What started it?
37:40 Has Hemant interacted with Muslims? What were the issues they were raising?
39:50 The importance of coming out as an atheist and normalizing being an ex-Muslim.
41:45 Death threats and backlash to activism against religion.
43:20 Defending freedom of religion while also not aiding the far right in their anti-Muslims bigotry.
46:30 Losing friends and family because of leaving religion. The problem of nihilism. What can you substitute church/religion for?
53:00 Did religion survive this long because it was beneficial to people or for other reasons?
57:25 The harsh realities for non-believers in Pakistan.
58:27 Hemant’s advice to people who are questioning or want to leave religion. Advice for people who are coming back to religion.
1:01:50 Are Abrahamic religions better than non-Abrahamic religions?
1:03:28 What project is Hemant most proud of?
1:05:00 Hemant’s social media handles
1:05:40 Why Hemant’s perspective is US-centric?
1:06:20 Round of Quick questions
1:07:18 Final remarks

046 – Interview with Sadia Hameed on Identity Politics, The Regressive Left, Exmuslim Label, New Atheism

Interview with Sadia Hameed on Identity Politics, The Regressive Left, Exmuslim Label, New Atheism

The YouTube version of this podcast can be found here: https://youtu.be/BeUIxsBaP4M

Here are the timestamps for this podcast:

0:00 Introductions
0:52 Questioning Islam and leaving for the first time.
5:48 Eating pork for the first time. Is the ban on pork indoctrination or cultural conditioning?
11:18 Going back to Islam for marriage purposes.
15:40 Leaving Islam the second time after researching the life of a Muslim woman and her role as a “good Muslim wife”.
18:10 Problems with the wife-beating verse
23:03 The Gloucestershire sisters organization and their work.
29:19 Breaking off the engagement and going to University
33:50 Abdullah’s experience of leaving Islam.
38:25How family dynamics complicate the journey of questioning and leaving Islam.
38:20 Sadia’s anecdote on discussing the reformation of Islam.
39:50 Is reporting family members just intimidation or intended to actually have family members punished?
44:56 Parallels between leaving fundamentalist Christianity and leaving Islam.
47:53 No outsiders program and the protests surrounding it
53:13 Religious morality VS Secular morality.
56:18 Subjective interpretation of the Quran and problems associated with this kind of interpretation.
58:49 Toxicity of the antagonism between Islam and “kafars’ principles (science, the west and all other non-muslims)
1:06:10 The importance of challenging harmful ideas and ideologies wherever they pop up.
1:08:12 Break and appreciating channel supporters.
1:09:31 A critique of issues in the ex-Muslims community (Discussing tattoos and community policing among ex-Muslims)
1:16:25 Importance of criticizing people from the ex-Muslim community, free speech, and cancel culture.
1:24:29 Appealing to purity (Not being Muslim enough or ex-Muslim enough)
1:27:00 Internet feuds and edgy activism.
1:29:40 Conditioning support on political beliefs.
1:31:35 Short break, Sadia’s social media details.
1:32:48 A discussion on the ex-Muslim label and how it is impacting the movement.
1:45:05 Sadia’s final remarks
1:45:27 Abdullah’s final remarks

050 – JINNS (SPIRITS AND DEVILS) LIVESTREAM | THE TWO ABDULLAHS

Episode 5 of The TWO ABDULLAHS where we are discussing jinns, possessions, spirits, devils, magic

Donate to the show here

Download presentation here

Original YouTube link

Here are the timestamps for the podcast:

0:00 Introductions
1:10 Dawah man clip – a woman possessed by jinns through Facebook?
3:04 Genies superpowers and diet
5:30 Protection from Jinns.
7:50 Jinns in pre-Islamic Arabia. Three types of Jinns.
11:50 Jinns in Islam. Quran 15:27 and 55:15 – Allah’s Creation of Jinns. Surah Jinn and its revelatory circumstances.
18:10 Prophet VS Kahins. Angels throwing shooting stars to chase Genies.
24:44 – 25:11 Announcements.
25:12 Types of Jinns (Islam Q&A) Jinns and animals – dogs barking and donkeys braying at Jinns. Black dogs.
28:26 Does most of the concepts about jinns and exorcism come from a lack of knowledge of conditions like sleep paralysis, epilepsy, and mental problems?
35:31 Islamic exorcism – a clip. Understanding multiple personality disorders.
39:50 How do the two Abdullahs explain the voice changes of possessed people and other miracles?
53:20 Black dogs are jinns so kill them (Hadith). Snakes might be jinns.
58:28 Is there a better English translation of the Quran? The two Abdullahs’ take on an unexplainable experience.
1:06:25 Orthodox Sunni Muslim who believes in Jinns but not Jinn’s possession because the Quran does not specifically mention this. Did the two Abdullahs’ ever have an experience that might be attributed to Jinns?
1:14:48 Genies and religious beliefs – Genies worship Allah and can change religions? Quran 72:1-4.
1:16:38 Genies eat dung and bones.
1:17:50 Allah will fill hell with genies and humans.
1:19:45 Did the Apostate Prophet used to believe in Genies? Applying skepticism to paranormal claims.
1:21:22 A woman claiming to be Lucifer, Nero, and other funny names all in one.
1:24:15 How hard is it for the two Abdullahs to partake in online activism against Islam? Is it easy to make an impact in this area?
1:32:25 Is Satan (Iblees) a Jinn or an angel?
1:34:50 Genies in human form.
1:36:04 False advertising by fundamentalist Muslims? Sunnah curing cancer? Jinns having a crush on a person.
1:41:36 Jinn culture in Pakistan is because of treating religion as a business. Also, this concept takes advantage of women. Is the addition of Iblees a revisionist attempt to include angels and jinns into the free will argument?
1:52:02 The Islamic narrative on free will.
1:52:35 Jinns can mislead mankind. Jinns can make babies cry.
1:54:50 Solomon’s Genie construction company. Teleporting Genies?
1:56:48 Abdullah Gondal’s family anecdote on Jinns? Whispers of Jinns.
2:00:22 Jinns raping people. Supernatural sex experiences?
2:01:55 How to protect yourself from Jinns. Protect babies from Jinns before sex
2:4:35 How is the Islamic concept of Jinns different from the west’s concept of Genie in the bottle?
2:06:20 Hadith on jinns in human form. Interactive recitation session with jinns.
2:09:05 Jinns coming out in the dark to steal
2:11:03 Warn the Jinns/ask the jinn if it is Muslim 3 times before killing them. Muhammad’s fight with the jinns. Farting Jinns.
2:14:23 Talking trees snitching on the jinns. Shayateen Genies are handcuffed during Ramadan.
2:16:10 A summary of Jinns and the stream.
2:23:20 Final remarks

045 – Interview with Former Taiwanese Muslim Convert Now Exmuslim Abdul

I am interviewing a Taiwanese Muslim Convert who has left Islam. He is going to tell us how he became Muslim and eventually left it.

The YouTube version of this podcast can be found here: https://youtu.be/ppvAh2BYq7Y

Here are the timestamps for this podcast:

0:00 Introductions
0:40 Why Abdul is sharing his story? Why is he doing it anonymously?
3:35 How Abdul found out about Islam? What drew him to Islam exactly?
9:40 Ignoring ex-Muslim friends’ advice.
11:30 Inconsistent faith. Having moments of doubts and faltering faith.
13:20 Doubts and why Abdul left Islam – real-life experience with a hardcore Salafi. Quran 3:28. Why was this a problem?
20:30 Not being able to practice cultural aspects because of Islam.
24:00 Leaving Salafism to become a non-sectarian Muslim. Doubting Islam and the many problems in Islamic texts and history.
27:35 When did Abdul learn about the problematic issues in Islamic texts and history? How did he reconcile them with modern moral values when he was a practicing Muslim?
32:00 How Abdul came to the final conclusion that Islam was not for him. Vestiges of the old Islamic states being taken seriously and being applied in the modern-day.
38:40 Paradox of nominal Muslims being disappointed by people living Islam when they themselves are not fully practicing.
44:20 If Islam is really true, why not go all the way instead of the half-hearted attempts? The Kaaba.
50:10 Is the Kaaba pagan? Demi-gods.
52:42 Spreading religion by the sword. Forcing both followers and non-believers to pay different types of taxes.
56:00 The unholy alliance of religion and politics and how it feeds into the concept of jihad.
1:01:20 Channel announcements.
1:03:12 How Abdul is planning to handle the process of leaving Islam and coming out.
1:07:10 Cultish characteristics of Islam particularly regarding apostates. How nominal Muslims take Islam more as an Identity/cultural heritage and less of a religion.
1:10:20 Having Muslim friends who have other things in common with you. It is a personal decision on whether to disclose information about your apostasy.
1:13:45 Adbul’s current spiritual status. The importance of skepticism.
1:17:43 Abdul and Abdullah’s final remarks.

044 – Interview with Ex-Evangelist Marie D’Elephant

Marie was raised in an evangelical household in Minnesota, USA. She began to have doubts at the age of 13 but didn’t pursue her doubts. She doubled down, again and again, to prove herself to god, resulting in her serving as an evangelical missionary in Mexico for two years with Youth With a Mission. After leaving Mexico, she began a gradual deconstruction and departure from her faith. Her life after that shift has not been easy.

The YouTube version of this podcast can be found here: https://youtu.be/aTmOPL0Va2s

Here are the timestamps for the podcast:

0:00 Introductions.
1:24 Marie’s religious background.
5:52 How Marie ended up having doubts despite living in a “religious bubble”.
8:18 Scientific explanation for skepticism.
12:14 Transactional/ incentivized charity work and other religious deeds by religious organizations. Is there Altruism?
18:48 Doubting. Being an atheist at seminary and mission.
24:50 Treatment of women by fundamentalist regions. Purity culture.
34:00 Parallels between Christian version of purity culture and Islamic version. Social skills.
39:20 Arranged marriages. Priorities for choosing a partner. Attractions between partners.
47:00 Homosexuality, Religious morality, and its main objectives
50:11 Objectivity and the need to be agnostic on many topics.
54:04 Apathy for this life because we are promised the next life and believing God will take care of our problems.
55:52 Is America a white supremacist country? Systemic racism in America.
58:40 Abdullah’s perspective on racism in the west and the treatment of native Canadians.
1:09:40 The gun problem in America.
1:14:50 Channel announcements.
1:16:33 Marie’s podcast and other social media handles.
1:19:25 The need to train de-escalation tactics (Police violence)
1:20:00 Segregation. Are white people inherently evil? Hiring quotas.
1:28:20 Framing in the racism discussion. What does racism mean? is a person racist or just has racist tendencies?
1:37:10 Marie and Abdullah’s closing remarks.

043 – Interview with Ex-Muslim Convert Joseph Colden

Interview with a former Islamic convert from the UK.

The YouTube version of this podcast can be found here: https://youtu.be/sCDeoLioZ58

Here are the timestamps for this podcast:

0:00 Introductions
0:42 Joseph’s background in the nominal Christian home in the UK and how he came across Islam – Being sold a sanitized version of Islam and Muhammad by cultural Muslims.
8:45 How an Imam tried to hook up Joseph with an Islamic girl.
12:45 What was life like for Joseph as a Muslim? What was keeping him Muslim?
17:18 Did Joseph participate in community events and does he miss any of them?
18:18 How did the Muslim community react to Joseph’s apostasy.
20:03 What finally led Joseph out of Islam? The issue of Aisha, Why is people can convert to Islam without knowing Arabic but when leaving they are required to know Arabic?
29:20 Why are people encouraged to go through Islamic texts with scholars instead of researching for themselves? How Muslims steer away converts from reading Bukhari and other texts on their own in order to prevent them from seeing the realities of Islam.
35:11 The tokenism of Muslim converts in the UK. How being a convert opened doors for Joseph to meet with some controversial Islamic teachers and scholars
37:50 Mosques in people’s sitting rooms teaching fringe extreme interpretations of the Quran and hadiths
40:05The contradictions in the Quran and the apologetics provided by Muslims. The US VS them mentality in Muslims is reinforced by Islamic teachings. How some Muslims give the Sharia law a Utopian outlook when they are talking to converts.
49:40 Making Muhammad the pinnacle of perfection and morality and the problems that come with this take.
53:00 Apostasy laws and how they are applied in Islamic states.
55:05 Abdullah Sameer clarifies his claim that there was child marriage in the bible
57:11 Joseph’s experiences after leaving Islam – being attacked for criticizing Islam. The bias by law enforcement officers when dealing with apostates and their families.
1:02:40 Fringe Muslims passing Pamphlets advocating for ISIS in 2013 and 2014 and advocating for the Caliphate and Islamism in the Western. The issues of free speech – where should the line be drawn?
1:11:55 Final remarks

042 – Interview with A Pakistani Exmuslim Anti-Theist

Discussing with a 45 year old Pakistani anti-theist today who left Islam 2 years ago.

The YouTube version f this podcast can be found here: https://youtu.be/xCXu3yOlvLo

Here are the timestamps for this podcast:

0:00 Introductions
1:11 Super Sufi’s background – How he alternated between being a very conservative Muslim and being a nominal Muslim. How he became Ultra conservative in the last ten years. How Super Sufi convinced his wife to convert to Islam.
11:45 How Super Sufi used to perform Dawah to his students in Russia – proselytizing during English classes.
13:15 The direction of the Qibla – Is it even a real thing since the earth is not a circle as mentioned in the Quran? “Sacred city” by Dan Gibson and how it sparked the questioning process for Super Sufi. How Super Sufi’s beliefs began to unravel as he was trying to prove his religious beliefs right only to get evidence to the contrary.
19:50 Islamic rituals borrowed from other cultures e.g. Zoroastrianism. Problems with the hadiths and their origins. How Muslims imposed their cultures and traditions on Iranians.
24:20 The door of heaven in Pakistan? Worshipping saints and creating shrines – This is a common practice used to make money in different religions. Buddha and his teachings – was he a revolutionary?
31:40 Is the need for religion an intrinsic characteristic of humans? How political elites – Constantine in Christianity and Caliphs and Imams in Islam – crafted religions around influential people to their benefit using very similar rituals.
37:30 The Noah’s ark story. How the abhorrent practice of incest is common in all the major religions – Is the story of Adam and Eve even true given what we know about genetic tracing and speciation?
45:00 Is the number of hadiths memorized by Bukhari true or realistic? How is it that most of the hadiths were revealed to Abu Hurairah only and not the other Sahabas? The flaws in the process transmission of the hadiths.
51:30 The miracles in the Quran and hadiths – splitting the moon, going to the seven heavens, going to Jerusalem overnight – was this all a scam?
54:00 Super Sufi’s belief about God being conscious energy (Deistic God). The god particle.
1:00:50 What happens when we die? Is there a soul? – What scientific studies have shown in cases of head trauma or diseases like Alzheimer’s disease.
1:05:09 Was Buddha really against the caste system?
1:06:45 The similarities between Super Sufi’s position as a Deist and Abdullah’s position as an Atheist. The hypocrisy of criticizing Islamic teaching but also accepting Christian teachings can be refuted by the same criticism against Islam.
1:09:20 Political religions like Islam hinder the progress of society and suppress minorities.
1:21:47 So what happens now that Super Sufi is a Deist in Pakistan. Why will he never become an atheist? – Pascal’s wager.
1:25:00 The seventy-two virgins – how this teaching is used to inspire Jihad.
1:28:35 Where does Abdullah live?
1:28:50 Why is it God had to create billions of galaxies just for mankind?
1:31:20 What are Super Sufi’s future plans and projects he is working on? How religions take advantage of the illiterate masses. The paradox of educated people believing in silly religious teachings.
1:41:23 Final remarks.

041 – HEAVEN in Islam | LIVE CALL IN SHOW | The Two Abdullahs Episode 6

HEAVEN in Islam | LIVE CALL IN SHOW | The Two Abdullahs Episode 6

Here are the timestamps for this podcast:

0:00 Introduction
1:40 The appeals of paradise (materialistic offering in heaven)
6:34 A discussion on the 8 doors to heaven (A clip).
11:13 The different levels in paradise (economy vs Business class)
14:40 Description of women in paradise
25:54 Free will in Heaven VS in the real-world (problem of suffering), Definition of beauty (how it is subjective)
32:15 Why is the Islamic idea of materialistic heaven such a pull for a lot of people? What was the hosts’ idea of heaven when they were still Muslims?
41:25 The importance of Laughing at religious beliefs to expose their absurdity. Quranic verses on treating people in hell.
46:18 Sunday Bazar in Jannah
50:00 How Evolution/science explains our current state better than Islam
53:39 A critique of the idea of heaven and how it led the caller to apostasy. Apologetics on women who desires more men.
1:00:00 Caller#4
1:02:56 What men would look like in Islamic heaven? Hadith on 70 penises in heaven.
1:07:35 What would Dr. Zakir Naik be doing in heaven 🙂
1:08:03 Giants in paradise.
1:11:20 Flying with angeL and other materialistic promises in heaven
1:15:10 Immortal boys in paradise
1:23:15 At what age do Islamic children start receiving teachings about the Quran?
1:27:36 Channel announcements
1:28:30 Some flimsy arguments against Islam
1:30:30 Who goes to paradise
1:34:16 What men get, the transparent houris
1:38:45 What women get in paradise
1:39:10 Were the hosts’ taught Mohammad was the best person? Issues of verifying hadiths and how to get apologetics resources
1:50:26 Are Asian religions (e.g Hinduism and Buddhism) better than Islam?
1:58:29 How do believers believe absurd beliefs ( flying donkey)
2:02:38 Hadith on 70 penises that are eternally erect
2:05:30 Women and heaven
2:09:35 Food in Paradise
2:11:52 Fast track to heaven (harmful ideas that are supposed to guarantee a good place in heaven)
2:15:00 Conclusion

Youtube version of the podcast.